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Obama Pastor: 9/11 Wake Up Call For Whites

The following is from a pdf file of sermon from Barack Hussein Obama’s "spiritual mentor" as published in October 2003 issue of the Trinity United Church of Christ’s publication, "The Trumpet."  (Published by the Reverend’s daughter.)

The sermon is really a wide ranging diatribe which includes, among other things, calls for US divestiture in Israel. But even amidst the Reverend’s many crackpot and racist statements, this one jumped out:

Maybe I Missed Something!

A Message From our PASTOR, Rev. Dr. Jeremiah A. Wright, Jr., Senior Pastor

In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the Western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just “disappeared” as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring Black concerns.

Again, Reverend Wright is the man that Mr. Obama claims got him interested in politics. He speaks of him as his political father and even his surrogate father.

From the Chicago Tribune:

Pastor inspires Obama’s ‘audacity’

By Manya A. Brachear
January 21, 2007

When he took over Trinity United Church of Christ in 1972, Rev. Jeremiah Wright Jr. was a maverick pastor with a wardrobe of dashikis and a militant message…

Obama, was not a churchgoer at the time, but he found himself returning to the sanctuary of Trinity United. In Wright he had found both a spiritual mentor and a role model…

[Wright] eventually returned to Howard University to finish bachelor’s and master’s degrees in English with a focus on African spirituals. At the University of Chicago Divinity School, he earned another master’s in the history of religions with a focus on Islam…

In his 1993 memoir "Dreams from My Father," Obama recounts in vivid detail his first meeting with Wright in 1985. The pastor warned the community activist that getting involved with Trinity might turn off other black clergy because of the church’s radical reputation.

When Obama sought his own church community, he felt increasingly at home at Trinity…

Later he would base his 2004 keynote speech to the Democratic National Convention on a Wright sermon called "Audacity to Hope," – also the inspiration for Obama’s second memoir, "The Audacity of Hope."

Though Wright and Obama do not often talk one-on-one often, the senator does check with his pastor before making any bold political moves.

Last fall, Obama approached Wright to broach the possibility of running for president. Wright cautioned Obama not to let politics change him, but he also encouraged Obama, win or lose…

Maybe we missed something, when so many put so much faith in a person we knew nothing about.

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This article was posted by Steve Gilbert on Friday, March 9th, 2007 at 5:23 am. You can leave a response.

41 Responses to “Obama Pastor: 9/11 Wake Up Call For Whites”

  1. Sharps Rifle
    March 9th, 2007 at 7:27 am

    Now why am I not surprised that someone who attended a madrassa would feel so at home in a “church” that preaches such a warped parody of Christianity? From what I can tell from their website, if Wright were white, he’d wear a sheet.

    No wonder so many Dems like Obama…his church is as racist as they are.

    My disgust knows no words.

  2. drdobgyn
    March 9th, 2007 at 8:14 am

    Sharps riflee you should at least get your facts correct concerning the madrassa school fantasy that being reported over conservitve media outlets. http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITI......madrassa/
    As far as your racist comment concerning my church I think jb1125 siad it best.

    jb1125
    March 8th, 2007 at 10:12 pm
    Barack Obama, along Oprah Winfrey and many other Chicacagoans, belongs to Trinity United Church of Chirst. The church follows black liberation theology. “Liberation theology is a school of theology that focuses on Jesus Christ as not only the Redeemer but also the Liberator of the Oppressed. It emphasizes the Christian mission to bring justice to the poor and oppressed, particularly through political activism.”Wikipedia

    Why is there a need for a black liberation theology?
    One of the major focuses of liberation theology is, as mentioned above, to bring justice to the poor and oppressed. According to the Pastor Jeremiah Wright, “It [black liberation theology] originates in the days of the Trans-Atlantic slave trade.” Throughout American history, African Americans have been the poor and oppressed, for the most part only due to their skin color. Thus, it is practical for blacks to unite together under a specific liberation theology that is relevant to their struggle.

    Kevin Considine, graduate student at Catholic Theological Union, comments on Obama’s church for religionandspirituality.com :
    “Recently the Illinois Democrat has been criticized for something that should be a positive: his church affiliation. No, not because he attends church. And not because he’s being honest about rooting his politics in his faith.

    No, he’s taking flak because his church, Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, has linked traditional Christian faith to black empowerment and combating “middle-classness.” What this means is that the church’s theology preaches a foundation of loving God and loving one’s neighbor by attempting to apply these tenets to real life in the community. So, the church champions ideals such as the black family, racial justice and a materially humble lifestyle as ways to live out discipleship to Christ.

    To be honest, I’m not sure how this is a problem. But the revelation that an African-American family is attending a vigorous and socially conscious black church is apparently a touchy subject. One could, ahem, speculate about the motives behind such touchiness. But let it suffice to say that Sen. Obama’s church affiliation has raised some hackles.

    For example, Fox News pundit Sean Hannity has suggested that the church is divisive and borders on being a separatist cult. And MSNBC talking head Tucker Carlson has claimed that Obama’s church proclaims a “racially exclusive theology” that seems to “contradict the basic tenets of Christianity.” This is because, in Mr. Carlson’s opinion, Christianity is explicitly “anti-racial.”

    Right. As if Christianity is far off in another dimension and completely divorced from the messiness of everyday life. As if holiness and righteousness are possible without confronting the evils that exist in our midst.

    Exactly what tenets of Christianity can a church that describes itself as “unapologetically Christian” be contradicting? They seem to be doing just fine with Jesus’ command to love the Lord your God and love your neighbor. And they seem to truly embrace the demand for social justice that has deep roots in Scripture. Their dedication to the gospel may be challenging to many of us, and that’s a good thing, but it’s disingenuous to call them divisive and separatist when they clearly focus on God as revealed through Jesus.

    And if by “anti-racial” Mr. Carlson means that there isn’t a clearly mandated Christian response to racism because it isn’t a current problem, then he’s deluding himself. The problem persists, and thus racial reconciliation and justice are indeed Christian mandates. They go part and parcel with following Christ.

    Having said that, I think that the critiques of Trinity Church of Christ reveal more about us as a country than about Sen. Obama or his critics. It shows that there are some versions of Christianity that make us comfortable and some that don’t.

    If a church’s theology preaches Jesus through self-reliance, personal morality, building wealth and colorblindness, then we don’t have much problem with it. But if a church’s theology talks about community building, personal and social responsibility, the sin of materialism and black empowerment or racial reconciliation, then we become uncomfortable.

    This difference is similar to what theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer called the distinction between cheap grace and costly grace. Cheap grace is what makes us comfortable, because it doesn’t ask much of us. Costly grace, however, challenges us to be Christ-like by sacrificing and taking up our cross. It asks us to risk our comfort and get our hands dirty in the real world. If there’s any confusion between the two, it’s safe to say that Jesus’ call and gift is that of costly grace.

    This is the grace that Sen. Obama’s church seems to proclaim. For they’re not out there preaching the gospel of health and wealth. That is, they don’t theologize that the God of Jesus Christ is some great ATM machine in the sky that will provide goods to consume. Instead, they’re dedicated to loving God, serving others, nurturing the souls of its congregants and bridging the divide between the poor, middle and upper classes within their church community. In short, they’re interested in authentic witness to the Gospel within a specific context.

    If this makes some uncomfortable, so be it. At least they’re following Jesus in a way that aims for righteous transformation of the real world rather than a pie-in-the-sky kind of way.

    Now I’m not saying that Sen. Obama is a victim here. Nor am I trying to get votes for him, although I must admit that I’ve sent a few bucks to his campaign. And I’m not saying he’s a saint, either. Heck, I don’t even know the man.

    My point is simple. I’m sure there are many ways that the media can criticize Sen. Obama’s candidacy. But his church is not a liability. And they should be ashamed for trying to make it seem like one. ”
    Link

    David Brody, a Christain Broadcast News correspondent, visited Obama’s church:

    “When I was out in Illinois covering Obama’s big presidential announcement in Springfield, our CBN crew went to Chicago and asked to shoot video inside the Church. A week before, I had put in multiple requests but I received no response. So on Sunday we walked into the Church and asked if we could film.After waiting about 15 minutes or so, they agreed and we started to videotape. After 20 minutes or so of videotaping, the Church said they meant still photography not video. There seemed to be a little miscommunication here. We immediately stopped filming. We ended up using still shots from the video that we had in our possession. I desperately tried to convince them to let us use the video but they said no.

    During my time inside their service, it seemed pretty normal to me. The worship was very charismatic, the music was up-tempo and the people seemed like they were really into it. I didn’t hear the preacher speak, so clearly that is extremely important. I can’t speak to that. But the people we dealt with were extremely nice. ” Link

    From State Of The Qusan, referring to Hannity’s coverage on FNC of Obama’s church:
    “I don’t know where they got this kneegro to go on TV and spew this BS but, being from Chicago, I’ve been to Trinity United Church of Christ. Many of my friends are members. Oprah Winfrey was once a member. It’s a typical black church, albeit it has many affluent members, and I cannot believe that anyone would stoop this low. It’s just disgusting!”

    Mission Statement of Church:
    Trinity United Church of Christ has been called by God to be a congregation that is not ashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ and that does not apologize for its African roots! As a congregation of baptized believers, we are called to be agents of liberation not only for the oppressed, but for all of God’s family. We, as a church family, acknowledge, that we will, building on this affirmation of “who we are” and “whose we are,” call men, women, boys and girls to the liberating love of Jesus Christ, inviting them to become a part of the church universal, responding to Jesus’ command that we go into all the world and make disciples!

    We are called out to be “a chosen people” that pays no attention to socio-economic or educational backgrounds. We are made up of the highly educated and the uneducated. Our congregation is a combination of the haves and the have-nots; the economicallydisadvantaged, the under-class, the unemployed and the employable.
    The fortunate who are among us combine forces with the less fortunate to become agents of change for God who is not pleased with America’s economic mal-distribution! W.E.B. DuBois indicated that the problem in the 20th century was going to be the problem of the color line. He was absolutely correct. Our job as servants of God is to address that problem and eradicate it in the name of Him who came for the whole world by calling all men, women, boys and girls to Christ.”Link

    Pastor Jeremiah Wright:
    “Black theology is one of the many theologies in the Americas that became popular during the liberation theology movement. They include Hispanic theology, Native American theology, Asian theology and Womanist theology.

    “We were always seen as objects. When we started defining ourselves, it scared those who try to control others by naming them and defining them for them; Oppressors do not like “others” defining themselves.”

    “African-centered thought, unlike Eurocentrism, does not assume superiority and look at everyone else as being inferior.

    “There is more than one center from which to view the world. In the words of Dr. Janice Hale, “Difference does not mean deficience. It is from this vantage point that Black liberation theology speaks. ”
    Link

    Barack Obama:
    “If I say to anybody in Iowa — white, black, Hispanic or Asian — that my church believes in the African-American community strengthening families or adhering to the black work ethic or being committed to self-discipline and self-respect and not forgetting where you came from, I don’t think that’s something anybody would object to. … I think I’d get a few amens.”
    Link

    As for the claim the church is more loyal to Africa than America, “while the Trinity website contains a “10-point Vision” that calls for its congregation to make “a non-negotiable commitment to Africa,” there is no statement on the website that such a commitment supersedes a parishioner’s commitment to the United States. Moreover, a fact sheet on the White House website is titled “The U.S. Commitment To Africa’s Growth And Prosperity,” and the Bush White House has reaffirmed its “commitment to Africa” as recently as 2005.” (Media Matters)
    http://www.obamapedia.org/page/Obama+Myths

  3. retire05
    March 9th, 2007 at 9:12 am

    This is not a sermon. It is a political rallying cry. If my pastor were to give a speech like this (change the word black to white) I would walk out and never go back. Sermons are to be about Christ, not my pastor’s favorite political cause.
    It is no wonder Jesse Jackson is not backing Obama. He is not about to deal with Rev. Wright. That would be a power struggle like none we have seen in centuries.

  4. wardmama4
    March 9th, 2007 at 9:13 am

    You can claim ‘fantasy’ all you want Dr. but in a time of War against radical islamic terrorists to be running a man who was born of an islamic father, raised by an islamic stepfather (madras or not) who embraces the islamic side of his heritage over the American one and ’somehow’ manages to find a ‘Christian’ church with a pastor who concentrated in Islam in his college study and expouses such race baiting and ethnocentric ‘beliefs’ under the guise of Christianity is WRONG and an affront to America, American people, the GWOT and is dangerous in this particular time.

    I know too many in America think that the GWOT is a rich white evilbushitlerburtonco concoction just to make money for their buds but sorry it was radical muslims who committed it and are still committing it - Iraq has digressed into a islamic terrorists against the US and Iraqis, not the US against the World.

    And I find Obama simply the wrong man to lead America at all. Until he becomes American and walks out of the door of this fake ‘Christian’ church.

    What you are not getting is that I am not advocating denying his African ancestry, nor denying that bad things happened to people of African heritage in America. But at the same time, I do not condone nor accept the extolling of it over America or the American way of life. - don’t like it - fine leave. Find injustice - report it. Work within the system to change it. Don’t force everyone to pay for the crime of one. Don’t indict everyone for the crime of one. And don’t be ethnocentric and then call me racist.

    I know denying - I made it an art form. So many aspects of my life, who I am (which I don’t even really know), I lived by a script that changed depending on who I was with. I played white to be white, red to be be red, healthy to get ahead, sick to get by, smart to get ahead and dumb to get away with it. And you know what - I got nowhere, kept doing the same crap over and over and getting the same terrible treatment.

    And then one day I stood up. Yes, it was for my children (7 years later I sat down and cried that I did not even value myself enough to stand up for me). Dusted us all off, did a few mental health sessions and re-committed to God. Now I am at peace with myself and my family and I personally do not care what anyone else thinks of me - because my life is between me and God.

    And if you don’t like me, it is your loss - God loves me the way I am. And as a Christian, I am required to point out falsehoods, especially when they are preached from the pulpit. And as a registered voter, I feel compelled to point out dangerous and fraudulent ‘candidates.’

  5. zoomie
    March 9th, 2007 at 9:36 am

    This seems to be going around in circles and Doc, you seem to be the only one not getting the point….. you accuse Sharps of being racist and then you cut and paste a response written by one person who supports your point of view. How do you explain a comment like this?

    “In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the Western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just “disappeared” as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring Black concerns.”

    Please explain to me how 9/11 is about white America ignoring black concerns?? Let’s jump on a national tragedy here and make it about US!! If I’m not mistaken, people of all races died that day. And it wasn’t about RACE, but a satanic inspired religion.

    So someone was able to go and find some quotes that bolster your church and pastor. I could find just as many that don’t. Say all you want, preaching about how white Americans are ignoring black concerns sounds pretty divisive to me.

    Seeing that your church affiliates itself with “the church of Christ”, I’m gonna jump in here and speak a little Christian. I’m not proselytzing here, but as a believer in the inerrancy of scripture, here goes. Our purpose on earth is to glorify God, not to be agents of social change. The problems and ills of the world are a result of sin: bigotry, intolerance, hatred, whatever, chalk it up to our own sinful nature. The solution (if you are a believer in Christ that is): Saving grace by faith in Jesus. The church needs to worry more about teaching repentnance and forgiveness of sins . Only then can real change begin. Good works are a result of a changed heart and transformed soul. The REAL gospel needs to be preached, not the social gospel.

    I don’t care if Oprah Winfrey goes to your church. As far as Christian role models go, she isn’t on the radar. She does great works, but to glorify herself and she can’t even commit to the man she has been living with for how long? She comes across as more “New Age” than Christian.

    “Having said that, I think that the critiques of Trinity Church of Christ reveal more about us as a country than about Sen. Obama or his critics. It shows that there are some versions of Christianity that make us comfortable and some that don’t.”

    So, if we don’t agree with the mission of this church, it makes us “racist”? My how that word keeps getting dropped around. And for some reason, we’re always the ones being called it. Versions of Christianity?? As far as I know, there’s only one.

    “The sermon is really a wide ranging diatribe which includes, among other things, calls for US divestiture in Israel.”

    See this is one thing I can’t reconcile to people who call themselves “Christian” (Jimmy Carter comes to mind),but have nothing but contempt and finger pointing for GOD’S CHOSEN PEOPLE. Read your scripture!!! That land is their’s because GOD GAVE IT TO THEM!! By the way, no such thing as the nation of Palestine ever existed(I think someone else made this point yesterday).

    I very rarely get on here and rant about anything, in fact, I haven’t posted on S&L for months, but this has got me good and ticked. I know in my heart of hearts, that our God does not condone blame and diviseness in ANYONE whoc claims to follow him. As far as the stories of discrimination, I think it surprises the doctor that we all have them. Again, it’s funny how “people of color” don’t think we white folks can be victims of discrimination or racism. I think that is the point EVERYONE tried to make on the other thread and you just never got it….. On a last note, the slams on SJ that continue are childish and uncalled for. You might have apologized, but it doesn’t seem sincere.

  6. The Redneck
    March 9th, 2007 at 9:58 am

    Maybe you could also tell us, “doc” about Wright’s “Iraq IQ Test“, wherein he tests his parishioners knowledge of various moon-bat anti-American conspiracy theories (helpfully provided by SG).

    Do you believe these are ‘nothing but Christianity’?

  7. Voice of Reason
    March 9th, 2007 at 10:01 am

    Nice try Doc…..but quoting an little known grad student/columnist from a college with links to terrorist organizations and a testimonial from a guy who didn’t hear a word of the sermon is a bit far from what those around here would deem “credible soure material” to debunk statements made which don’t coincide with your own. Try this one on for size…..

    The Catholic Theological Union And The Limits Of Understanding
    http://www.pipelinenews.org/in.....e=ctu3.htm

    And just for starters on the CNN debunking…..
    http://laotze.blogspot.com/200.....thats.html

    All truth be told…..I think most of us here at S&L are pretty firmly convinced Rev. Wright is a racist, seperatist and an anti-semite. His words speak volumes as to what is in his heart and have been WELL documented here. I for one am not firmly conviced of Sen. Obama’s outlook but I am seeing compelling evidence that leads me to believe he has as much business being my President as our pet cat. I don’t know if his elementary school was a madrassa…actually it seems that is still a point of contention. But that aside….his bond with Rev. Wright is enough for me to denounce him right along with Rev. Wright and his screed. At this point I don’t feel the need to FURTHER link the Senator to the Reverand or to FURTHER prove that his ideals are racist. I think I am to the point of looking to see if the Senator is going to try after all this to distance himself (I can’t see how for the life of me) from Rev. Wright to save his national political career. I don’t doubt folks from Ill. will continue to send him to Congress (the reasoning for that is another discussion) and he may very well get the nod from the Dem’s in the primaries (although I doubt it very seriously) but I think if he has any plans on being anything other than the Senator from the great state of Illinois he had better take steps to cut ties to this minister and explain some of his past.

    Hollywood and the ultra liberal left wing of the Dem party may be willing to turn a blind eye to his association with Rev. Wright (most of them wouldn’t care if Obama was a satanist), his upbringing, or his scofflaw mentality, but the rest of us are watching and a lot of us don’t particularly care for what we see.
    VoR

  8. Privatestock
    March 9th, 2007 at 11:21 am

    Read the Black Value System that this church and Obama promotes. The bottom line is “don’t be like whitey”. Or more specifically, “If you succeed, make sure it only benefits the black community. If your success benefits or in any way emulates the white community, you are not one of us.” What do you think “combatting middle-classness” is? It’s combatting whitey.

    Here is the current situation. If a black man gets educated (using the same public education system that most of us have), stays out of trouble, doesn’t make babies before he’s financially stable, and works hard in his chosen field, he will be as successful as any white man. If he doesn’t, he will need a government program to take care of him. This is what the civil rights movement was all about, AND IT SUCCEEDED. The reason it’s not working is because black America refuses to take advantage of the advances and freedoms that the civil rights movement won for them. The Black Value System promotes keeping blackness seperated from whiteness. “Let’s remember where we came from.” Which translates to “Let’s stay where we are and not let whitey enfuence us.”

    There is a line in the Black Value System that says a black man who lives in middle-classness has been warped by white society. In other words, if you are successful, you have sold out to whitey. This is the bullshit that keeps jesse jackson and al sharpton rich and the majority of black America poor. I grew up with a lot of black kids, and every one of them had exactly the same opportunities to learn and progress as I did. The fact that so many of them didn’t, illustrates the problem clearly. They didn’t want to. They weren’t dumber than me, they just didn’t want to act white. THAT is what black America desperately needs to fight today. The idea that success equals selling out.

  9. 1sttofight
    March 9th, 2007 at 11:30 am

    Success has no color except to blacks.

  10. Privatestock
    March 9th, 2007 at 11:34 am

    Thanks a lot for summing up my three paragraphs with one short sentence. I’ll be in the corner pouting.

  11. 1sttofight
    March 9th, 2007 at 11:49 am

    I was in a hurry, my glass was empty. ;)

  12. drdobgyn
    March 9th, 2007 at 12:06 pm

    Zoomie I didn’t call him a racist I just responded to him calling the church racist. I don’t know the man so how could I give him such a title. In addition it doesn’t surprise me that many people have experience racism. discrimination etc. What in my threads led you to believe that I believe that.

    In regards to SJ I haven’t made any insulting comments to him or about him since I apologized. So I’m not sure what you are referring too Zoomie. Remember I really trying to be civil. I’m new to this I came at it wrong initially and I think I’ve been appropriate since then.

    LET ME BE THE FIRST TO SAY I WILL NEVER CALL ANY OF YOU A RACIST FOR ANYTHING UNLESS YOU CALL ME A N*****. Howz that? Lastly, Zoomie I don’t agree with his sermon concerning 911. I don’t agree with all his sermons. I do have free will and intellect.

    Redneck are you asking if I believe in Christianity to the exclusion of all other religions?

    Private stock you seem to be saying that the purpose of the civil rights movement was to give Black people hand outs or did I misunderstand you.
    If a black man gets educated (using the same public education system that most of us have), stays out of trouble, doesn’t make babies before he’s financially stable, and works hard in his chosen field, he will be as successful as any white man. If he doesn’t, he will need a government program to take care of him. This is what the civil rights movement was all about, AND IT SUCCEEDED.

    I thought the purpose of the civil rights movement was to give Black American the right to vote without intimadation, access to higher education and freedom to disagree without being lynched among other things.
    Lastly I agree far to many Blacks equate success and education with trying to be White and that is unfortunate.

  13. retire05
    March 9th, 2007 at 12:22 pm

    “I thought the purpose ofthe civil rights movement was to give Black American the right to vote without intimadation, access to higher education and freedom to disagree without being lynched among other things.”

    Correct.

    But where is any of Dr. King’s speeches (who lead the Civil rights movement) did he make the demand for affirmative action, racial preferences, lower test standards to accomodate minorities, welfare checks for those who allowed their harmones to run out of control and could not support the result of unchecked and unprotected sex? Where did Dr. King say that he wanted equal but with special considerations?
    He didn’t.

    But yet, you have no problem with Rev. Wright preaching equal but seperate.

  14. The Redneck
    March 9th, 2007 at 12:37 pm

    Doc, the ability to be as successful as any white man pretty much implies voting, higher education, political discourse, etc. Why nitpick?

    And along those lines, I didn’t say anything about Christianity to the exclusion of other religions–that’s pretty much standard for Christians, after all. What I asked was, “Do you believe that these (by which I meant Wright’s “Iraq IQ Test” and the other blatant racism he’s spewed) to be ‘nothing but Christianity?” Do you believe that crackpot theories about how eeeeevil the United States is are part of Jesus Christs’ “Great Commission”? Do you believe that hatred of Israel and accusations that the Jews are running America are part of being in a fellowship of Christ? Do you believe that to be a Christian means to accuse the United States of various atrocities ranging from false to just-plain ridiculous?

    Is this “nothing but Christianity” or is it “anti-American political activism with a “Christian” label slapped onto it?

    Meanwhile, if you want to see why the black race is not succeeding as it should, check the reaction to Bill Cosby’s comments–or to Clarence Thomas, or Condi Rice, or any black person who succeeds in America without glorifying the crime and illegitimacy which plague our inner-cities. The slurs of “Uncle Tom”, “Aunt Jemima”, “Sell-out”, and “Oreo” do more harm to the black race than every “N-Word” ever shouted.

    When you teach your kids that women are “Ho’s”, that screwing women you’ve never met before and will never see again is cool, that the law is some racist construct you should ignore, that everything bad that happens to you in life is the fault of someone else and not something that you can help, that working hard and getting an education is equal to pissing on your heritage… what do you expect to happen?

  15. zoomie
    March 9th, 2007 at 12:40 pm

    “LET ME BE THE FIRST TO SAY I WILL NEVER CALL ANY OF YOU A RACIST FOR ANYTHING UNLESS YOU CALL ME A N*****. Howz that? Lastly, Zoomie I don’t agree with his sermon concerning 911. I don’t agree with all his sermons. I do have free will and intellect.:

    Glad to hear that Doc! Maybe there’s hope for you after all! And you’re right, you did apologize to SJ. I misunderstood the one remark on the other thread about the “hamburger”. My bad…

    I think we can agree to disagree on some things. I see where you’re coming from and hopefully you’re get a tiny glimpse of where we’re at. Guess that’s progress. Oh, and be careful with this blog thing, it can become VERY addictive! Kind of why I haven’t been here much lately! Peace out Doc!

  16. 1sttofight
    March 9th, 2007 at 12:55 pm

    Let me ask you a question drdobgyn .

    If you and I were real close friends and I called you a N******, Would you get all bent out of shape?

    The reason I ask is because I have a very good friend who lives in Birmingham, Ala who I call N****** all the time and he just laughs and calls me a H******..

    My question is, What is the big deal about the word, N******?

  17. choosesomething
    March 9th, 2007 at 1:34 pm

    Ask any A.C.L.U. LAWYER what the big deal is with the magic “N WORD”………can you say “BOAT PAYMENT”?………………

  18. Privatestock
    March 9th, 2007 at 1:48 pm

    Drdobgyn, yes you did misunderstand me. I said the purpose of the civil rights movement was to give blacks the same opportunity to become educated and succeed as whites had. And that it is exactly what has happened. And if a person, black or white, decides to ignore the freedoms they have and does not become educated he will not succeed, and it will be no one’s fault but his own.

    You took the part about a black person needing a government program to take care of him and threw out the part about a black person being just as able to take the steps to provide for himself as every white person is. How did you manage to misread it that way? Perhaps you read everything with a bias, because you certainly took it out of context.

    My point was that it’s a shame the way the civil rights movement accomplished everything it set out to accomplish, but the black community refuses to take advantage of that. The hatred of whites for treatment committed by previous generations is so great that they are willing to live in poverty to avoid looking like those they hate. And this church’s doctrine will keep it that way.

    I haven’t noticed any of your posts before this thread today, but I hope you’ll continue to post here. It’s all about exchange of ideas and opinions, and without this kind of dialog nothing will ever change for the better.

  19. fellicia
    March 9th, 2007 at 3:08 pm

    Around the time Barack was running for Senate, I happened to hear Rev. Wright preach on a cable access channel. I heard little about Christ and lots about racist affronts to Rev. Wright on airplanes (like not believing he could afford to fly first class, which he apparently can) and lots about the evils of George W. Bush–from the pulpit. So much for the separation of church and state. Can anyone imagine if a white candidate were found to be a member of a “white” church–meaning a church that was exclusive to whites? Rev. Wright has also written pro-Palestian, anti-Israel articles which used to be accessible on the church website but apparently are not, anymore. Judging by Barack’s own comments, in which he rejects the authority of the Bible and doesn’t know “if he’s going up or down” when he dies, I would say he has accepted a Christian theology that is quite a bit different from that taught by evangelical and conservative mainstream Protestant churches–white and black. I see Barack’s Christian “conversion” as a matter of convenience. It wouldn’t do for someone with political ambitions to admit he’s an agnostic or atheist, with more exposure growing up to Islam than to Christianity.

  20. Sharps Rifle
    March 9th, 2007 at 3:45 pm

    So the “doctor” thinks I’m a racist? Funny….he has no idea at all of my ethnic background. I might be red, I might be black, I might be any combination of ethnicities. But I do know this: Wright is a black David Duke and is worthy of no more regard than is David Duke. And if Obama goes along with that gas, then he’s in the same category as Robert Byrd.

    And “doctor,” if you want to make it personal, go for it. But just remember, I come from a LONG line of people who fought to defend their lands from outsiders, hung on to their culture against all odds and are still around today. Who do you think that is? The answer might surprise you, “doctor.” In short, you want a brawl, I’ll give you one….but I don’t engage in battles of wits with the unarmed, and you need to pick up a weapon.

    Little lesson from my fathers: Don’t bring a club to a gunfight.

  21. sheehanjihad
    March 9th, 2007 at 3:46 pm

    Hey Doc….thank you man…that was class.

  22. rocketman
    March 9th, 2007 at 8:26 pm

    Het Doc, allow me to re-phase my eariler comment…strike “he said, she said” and replace with….”No is isn’t, yes, he is” in reference to your wonderful Rev Wright. It gets a little boring to read this go around every post that you make.

    Do I think I am superior to you because I can spell??? Not hardly..While I only have one year of college, I did learn how to use a dictionary. I have one at my side always, so as not to look stupid! You have graciously admitted that you are a lousy speller. This is very scary Doc. When you write prescriptions, do your patients know you are a lously speller? Does the pharmacist know you are a lousy speller??

    You saud that you were not required to take history in college. Mayby that is one of your problems. Those who do not know history, as they say, are bound to repeat it…. or in your case, those who are duped into believing what a wached out racist fool says are bound to repeat his BS.

    Hey doc, you would better serve your patients by staying off this blog. We don’t need you marry-go-round logic.

    Have a nice week-end. Hope you break 80 on the links.

  23. rocketman
    March 9th, 2007 at 8:29 pm

    It seems I have locked out….this is a test

  24. 1sttofight
    March 9th, 2007 at 8:41 pm

    You failed RM, Try again. ;)

  25. rocketman
    March 9th, 2007 at 8:58 pm

    Ok 1st…I’ll try agn. I don’t know what happened….

    Doc, please allow me to re-phrase my comment of yesterday from “He siad, she said” to “yes he is, no he isn’t” in regards to your pastor. This merry-go-round has been going on for two days and you haven’t made any ground here.

    No, I do not feel superior to you because I can spell…thruth be known, I got smart and bought a dictionary. It is always at my side. My biggest concern at this point is for your patients is this….do they know you are a lousy speller?? Do their pharamcist’s know you are a lousy speller??? Hand writing is one thing but spelling can be deadly.

    As a parting shot Doc, since I do not intend to continue this circle jerk, why is it that the only threads you post on are these “yes he is, no he isn’t” racist stories???

    Hey, 1st…I’ma with on the Pelosi web site biz….

  26. 1sttofight
    March 9th, 2007 at 9:06 pm

    I guarantee she will not know what hit her, nor will her bodyguards.

  27. Lots Of Good Stuff On Barack HUSSEIN Obama’s September 11th - Justifying Church « Heal The Land With Spiritual Warfare
    March 9th, 2007 at 11:12 pm

    [...] by healtheland on March 10th, 2007 See link here, and pay attention to a lot of the other links contained in the article. This church has as much to [...]

  28. drdobgyn
    March 10th, 2007 at 12:51 am

    Sharps Rifle I never called you a racist. I just repeated what you wrote about the church… No wonder so many Dems like Obama…his church is as racist as they are. I don’t know anything about you and I said on a previous thread the I will never call anyone a racist unless they call me N*****. I have no intention of making this personal or any interest in a brawl with you.

    rocketman Let me help you a little bit on that last thread
    1.He siad, she said (spelling)
    It should be He said, she said

    2.No, I do not feel superior to you because I can spell…thruth be known, I got smart and bought a dictionary.(spelling)
    Don’t you mean truth be known?

    3.My biggest concern at this point is for your patients is this….do they know you are a lousy speller?? Do their pharamcist’s know you are a lousy speller??? (spelling and grammer)
    Extreamly poor sentance it should be…My biggest concern at this point are for your patients. Do they know that you are a lousy speller? Does their pharmacist know you are a lousy speller?

    1sttofight are you really serious about what’s wrong with the word N*****? I take it from your thread that you are White, your friend calling you H*****. That’s between you and your friend. I think its f***** up that he allows you to call him that but thats his problem.
    I grew up in a time when I was called N***** every day because I went to a predominent White high school and also lived in a predominatly White neighborhood in Chicago.N***** is a vile word that has been used by White people as a means to put down , insult, and hurt Black men and women for hundreds of years. Frankly I can’t believe that you even would ask me some shit like that.

  29. Retired_Chief
    March 11th, 2007 at 1:19 am

    Hey…who was that white guy standing next to Obama in the picture?

  30. jb1125
    March 11th, 2007 at 6:52 am

    For those of you scared Obama’s church can be considered on par with Nation of Islam:
    TNR Article (http://www.tnr.com/docprint.mhtml?i=20070319&s=lizza031907)
    “On a Sunday morning two weeks before he launches his presidential campaign, Obama is at Trinity United Church of Christ on the South Side, gently swaying from side to side under a giant iron cross. From the outside, the church looks more like a fortress than a house of worship, with high whitewashed brick walls topped with security cameras. Inside, Trinity is the sort of African American community that the young Obama longed to connect with when he first came to Chicago. The church’s motto is “unashamedly black and unapologetically Christian,” and sunlight streams through stained glass windows depicting the life of a black Jesus. The Reverend Doctor Jeremiah A. Wright Jr., Trinity’s pastor since 1972, flies a red, black, and green flag near his altar and often preaches in a dashiki. He has spent decades writing about the African roots of Christianity, partly as a way to convince young blacks tempted by Islam that Christianity is not “a white man’s religion.”

    Most of you clearly haven’t read Obama’s book, The Audacity of Hope. He devotes an two chapters, 74 pages, to faith and race. Here’s a response by the conservative Edward Blum:
    “Although he has been a vocal supporter of racial preferences in the past, Obama begins to suggest a different policy direction in The Audacity of Hope. Race-based affirmative action policies, he recognizes, have polarized the races, while race-neutral or universal programs unite them. Rightly or wrongly, white guilt has largely exhausted itself in America; even the most fair-minded whites tend to push back against suggestions of racial victimization–or race-specific claims based on the history of race discrimination in this country. During his first trip to New York as a young man, he writes, he began to grasp the almost mathematical precision with which America’s race and class problems joined.

    Advocates of class-based or race-neutral affirmative action have been around a long time–even then-governor George W. Bush supported need-based government contracting set-asides, as did many congressional Republicans in the 1990s. But, for the most part, no recent Democratic presidential aspirant has been as bold as Obama in discussing the problems with race-based affirmative action: An emphasis on universal, as opposed to race-specific, programs isn’t just good policy; it’s also good politics.

    Beneath this extraordinary statement, coming as it does from a black, Democratic, presidential aspirant, lies a massive iceberg capable of transforming the nation’s racial policies–if he has the courage to pursue it.

    Obama is correct about the political implications–it is beyond debate that ending race-specific programs is good politics. Given the chance, the overwhelming majority of whites want to end race-based affirmative action as was evidenced last November when Michigan voters passed the Michigan Civil Rights Initiative by a 16-point margin. Ward Connerly and Jennifer Gratz, the organizers of the Michigan voter initiative, have announced plans to organize similar initiatives on Election Day in 2008 in as many as nine states, including the swing states of Missouri, Colorado, and Arizona. It is unlikely this has escaped the attention of campaign strategists in either party.

    This presents Barack Obama with unique opportunity. Having campaigned against the passage of the Michigan initiative, can he chart a new path now that he is running for president? And, having admitted he attended Harvard Law School because of affirmative action, can he now say the time has come to try something different?

    To both questions, the answer is Yes. First, he is on record in his enthusiasm for universal preference policies, so advocating for race-neutral affirmative action is a short leap for him to make politically. Second, just because he was admitted to a prestigious school because of racial preferences does not mean his two young daughters should be as well. After all, it is unreasonable for him to argue that in 2007 his daughters should have the bar lowered for them, while the daughters of a white working-class family should not.

    A pro-civil rights Democrat doesn’t become complicit in an anti-civil-rights agenda because he or she questions the efficacy of certain affirmative action programs, he wrote shortly before the last election. So, like Nixon’s overture to China, it may fall to a liberal, black Democrat like Barack Obama to question the wisdom of our current race-based affirmative-action polices and map a new course. Let’s hope he does.”
    http://www.aei.org/publication.....detail.asp

    So when is he for affirmative action programs?
    “Affirmative action programs, when properly structured, can open up opportunities otherwise closed to qualified minority candidates without diminishing opportunities for white students. Given a dearth of black and Latino Ph.D. candidates in mathematics and the physical sciences, for example, a modest scholarship program for minorities interested in getting advanced degrees in these fields (a recent target of a Department of Justice inquiry) won’t keep white students out of such programs, but can broaden the pool of talent that America will need for all of us to prosper in a technology-based economy. Moreover, as a lawyer who’s worked on civil rights cases, I can say that where there’s strong evidence of prolonged and systematic discrimination by large corporations, trade unions, or branches of municipal government, goals and timetables for minority hiring may be the only meaningful remedy possible.

    Many Americans disagree with me on this as a matter of principle, arguing that our institutions should never take race into account, even if it is to help victims of past discrimination. Fair enough—I understand their arguments and don’t expect the debate to be settled anytime soon. But that shouldn’t stop us form at least making sure that when two equally qualified people—one minority and one white—apply for a job, house, or loan, and the white person is consistently preferred, then the government, through prosecutors and through the courts, should step in to make things right.” (244)

    “Although government action can help change behavior…a transformation in attitudes has to begin in the home, and in neighborhoods, and in places of worship. Community-based institutions, particularly the historically black church, have to help families reinvigorate in young people a reverence for educational achievement, encourage healthier lifestyles, and reengergize traditional social norms surrounding the joys and obligations of fatherhood” (245)

    “the most important tool to close the gap between minority and white workers may have little to do with race at all. These days, what ails working-class and middle-class blacks and Latinos is not fundamentally different from what ails their white counterparts: downsizing, outsourcing, automation, wage stagnation, the dismantling of employer-based health-care and pension plans, and schools that fail to teach young people the skills they need to compete in a global economy. ” (245)

    “An emphasis on universal, as opposed to race-specific, programs isn’t just good policy, it’s also good politics. . . white guilt has largely exhausted itself in America; even the most fair-minded of whites, those who would genuinely like to see racial inequality ended and poverty relieved, tend to push back against suggestions of racial victimization–or race-specific claims based on the history of race discrimination in this country.” (247)

    To assert or to imply that Barack Obama, who is half-white, who was raised by a white mother and two white grandparents, is anything close to a black supremacist is ridiculous. No matter what your view is of the church, whose mission statement, once again, says, “As a congregation of baptized believers, we are called to be agents of liberation not only for the oppressed, but for all of God’s family.”, there is absolutely no evidence that Barack Obama is a racist.

    Obama has no reason to apologize or condemn a church because someone else interprets their pastor or values as black supremacist. He interprets black values as a way to spur social change.

    From his Call to Renewal Address:
    “It wasn’t until after college, when I went to Chicago to work as a community organizer for a group of Christian churches, that I confronted my own spiritual dilemma.

    I was working with churches, and the Christians who I worked with recognized themselves in me. They saw that I knew their Book and that I shared their values and sang their songs. But they sensed that a part of me that remained removed, detached, that I was an observer in their midst.

    And in time, I came to realize that something was missing as well — that without a vessel for my beliefs, without a commitment to a particular community of faith, at some level I would always remain apart, and alone.

    And if it weren’t for the particular attributes of the historically black church, I may have accepted this fate. But as the months passed in Chicago, I found myself drawn - not just to work with the church, but to be in the church.

    For one thing, I believed and still believe in the power of the African-American religious tradition to spur social change, a power made real by some of the leaders here today. Because of its past, the black church understands in an intimate way the Biblical call to feed the hungry and cloth the naked and challenge powers and principalities. And in its historical struggles for freedom and the rights of man, I was able to see faith as more than just a comfort to the weary or a hedge against death, but rather as an active, palpable agent in the world. As a source of hope.

    And perhaps it was out of this intimate knowledge of hardship — the grounding of faith in struggle — that the church offered me a second insight, one that I think is important to emphasize today.”
    http://www.barackobama.com/200.....ddress.php

    Obama’s pastor may be his spiritual mentor, but Obama doesn’t blindly follow all of the pastors views. For instance, Obama just called for support of Israel.
    http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/co.....ipac_today

    Would I say McCain’s visit to liberty University means that he agrees with everything Jerry Falwell says? No.

    And Obama didn’t attend a madrassah can we please stop that BS.
    http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITI......madrassa/
    http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp

  31. The Redneck
    March 11th, 2007 at 11:04 am

    That’s a nice, if somewhat long, article, JB–next time, paraphrase it instead of cut-and-pasting, and folks will be more likely to read your post, respond to it, keep up the political debate, all that good stuff.

    While I’m certain Obama has made some conservative-sounding statements, so has Bill Clinton, who proclaimed himself a “New Democrat.” So did David Souter of the Supreme Court, who was attacked by various anti-life groups but turned out to be the worst thing to happen to fetuses since the invention of the vacuum cleaner. So have anti-semitice race-pimps Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, from time to time.

    In other words, what he says is nice, but what does he do?

    But that still doesn’t explain why Obama looks upon a despicable man–a racist, an anti-semite, a race-pimp, and an absolute crackpot–and says “this guy is my spiritual mentor.”

    BTW—

    Would I say McCain’s visit to liberty University means that he agrees with everything Jerry Falwell says? No.

    Nice straw-man, there. Nobody’s upset because Obama paid a visit to this church. The issue isn’t even that Obama regularly attended this church to listen to the wingnut’s screeds (although that certainly would have raised a few red flags). If McCain had come back to the campaign trail telling us that Falwell is his “spiritual mentor”, it would be reasonable to assume that McCain holds at least some of the same beliefs as Falwell, would it not?

  32. 1sttofight
    March 11th, 2007 at 12:10 pm

    1sttofight are you really serious about what’s wrong with the word N*****?

    Are you so immature and insecure that you will let a mere word upset you? Geeees…

  33. jb1125
    March 11th, 2007 at 1:05 pm

    Sorry for the long post. While I just wanted to be make sure I got my point across,.. I see how that could lead to me getting my post ignored.

    “In other words, what he says is nice, but what does he do?”

    Obama is a progressive. There’s no question about it. But what he does do is listen to other points of view.

    “When you come in, especially as a freshman, and work on something like ethics reform, it’s not necessarily a way to endear yourself to some of the veteran members of the Illinois General Assembly,” said state Sen. Kirk W. Dillard, a Republican who became a friend. “And working on issues like racial profiling was contentious, but Barack had a way both intellectually and in demeanor that defused skeptics.”
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....02262.html

    “Certainly, Barack and I were hardly best friends; he was a year ahead of me at Harvard Law School (and six years older) when we met the summer that I became a newly-minted editor of the Harvard Law Review. But we did work together for some time, and he reached out to advise me when I became the first female Managing Editor in the Review’s history.

    Barack is a deeply committed liberal, and I am a proud conservative. Even so, he possesses five qualities that are genuinely praiseworthy — political ideology aside: ”
    http://www.townhall.com/Column.....ments=true

    “This presents Barack Obama with unique opportunity. Having campaigned against the passage of the Michigan initiative, can he chart a new path now that he is running for president? And, having admitted he attended Harvard Law School because of affirmative action, can he now say the time has come to try something different?

    To both questions, the answer is Yes. First, he is on record in his enthusiasm for universal preference policies, so advocating for race-neutral affirmative action is a short leap for him to make politically. Second, just because he was admitted to a prestigious school because of racial preferences does not mean his two young daughters should be as well. After all, it is unreasonable for him to argue that in 2007 his daughters should have the bar lowered for them, while the daughters of a white working-class family should not.”
    http://www.aei.org/publication.....detail.asp

    Are you saying that Obama was lying in his book? Bill Clinton made a lot of conservative sounding statements and made some conservative decisions such as the NAFTA and his work on welfare reform. Bush hasn’t even been able to get the SAFTA passed.

    Obama has supported affirmative action in the past and he explains why he has in his book. But he still comes out in favor of universal preference policies in most cases. McCain, Bush, Guiliani, and Romney are all in favor of some sort of affirmative action. I was arguing there is as much evidence that Obama is a black supremacist, than there is that McCain, Guliani, Bush, and Romney are black supremacists. Affirmative action is clear, race related issue. And Obama’s views aren’t black supremacist.

    But that still doesn’t explain why Obama looks upon a despicable man–a racist, an anti-semite, a race-pimp, and an absolute crackpot–and says “this guy is my spiritual mentor.”
    I haven’t seen any evidence that Obama’s pastor is any of these things.

    A racist?
    Yes, he refers to “white America” and the “great white west.” And his church has black values. But that doesn’t in any way indicate that he feels that blacks are somehow superior to whites.

    An anti-semite?
    He supports divestment from Israel. That’s quite different from saying he hates Jews.

    I don’t even know what race-pimp is… He leads a black church.

    If you think he’s a crackpot, then that is your opinion. I can’t really argue against that like that. “Pastor Wright holds a Doctor of Ministry Degree from United Theological Seminary, a Master’s degree from Howard University, an additional Master’s degree from the University of Chicago Divinity School and seven honorary doctorate degrees.” He’s not an idiot.
    http://www.tucc.org/pastor.htm

    If McCain had come back to the campaign trail telling us that Falwell is his “spiritual mentor”, it would be reasonable to assume that McCain holds at least some of the same beliefs as Falwell, would it not?
    I agree the Falwell-McCain example is tenuous.

    But what about Bush and Billy Graham?
    “George Bush — struggling with business failures and a drinking problem — made a life-altering decision in the 1980s after spending a weekend with longtime family friend Billy Graham: “It was the beginning of a new walk where I would recommit my heart to Jesus Christ,” Bush later wrote. The change that decision produced in his life, friends say, was both remarkable and genuine.”
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/.....opsis.html

    Billy Graham has been a spiritual mentor of Bush. And Graham is on the record (the Nixon tapes) saying anti-semitic statements. I’ll assume that Bush holds some of the same beliefs as him, but only those that there is public evidence for.

    I think it’s reasonable to assume that Obama holds some of the same beliefs as his pastor. But only those that there is public evidence for. To assume anything else is just baseless speculation.

    I apologize for this response still being kind of long. I tried to keep it shorter and paraphrase this time. I would like to say I do appreciate this discussion. It’s hard to find places like this.

  34. wardmama4
    March 11th, 2007 at 1:41 pm

    jb1125 -

    diff is President Bush does not attend Billy Graham’s church every time he can, does not call Billy Graham’s church ‘his church’ and in all my life I never heard any of the twisted and distorted ‘facts’ from Billy Graham in a ’sermon.’

    I used to listen to Billy Graham alot but stopped when he brought former President Clinton up on stage at his farewell sermon - won’t have a thing to do with his ‘ministry’ since.

    That is what a Christian is suppose to do when a minister or church espouses something that is against the Bible and God.

  35. 1sttofight
    March 11th, 2007 at 1:50 pm

    Hey, I thought the Rev. Jacksoooon ( of the hump if u gotum church) was Bubba’s pastor? Did I miss something?

    BTW, From what I understand, EQ may be holding her Brand New Son as we speak.

  36. The Redneck
    March 11th, 2007 at 10:29 pm

    First of all–while it’s true that Clinton was as willing to sell out his liberal principles as his moral ones for profit, gain, or physical pleasure, the welfare reform bill he eventually voted in was not in the slightest “his work on welfare reform”. He vetoed it twice, only signed it into law the third time after his pollsters told him he could kiss re-election goodbye if he vetoed it again (and remember, this was a guy who would ask for a quick show of hands to see which woman he should commit adultery with on campaign stops.). Even then, he said he was certain the bill sucked. Meanwhile, he appointed absolute nutcases to the Supreme Court (check out Ginsburg’s work for the ACLU on lowering the age-of-consent to 12, or for that matter the majority of Souter’s absolutely numbnut rulings), hiked up taxes, boned our military sideways and lubeless, tried to blame Rush Limbaugh for the Oklahoma City bombing, turned down Bin Laden’s head on a platter, and all the other liberal moves for which he’s quite rightly maligned as one of our worst and most corrupt presidents ever.

    Nixon, after all, as a pretty moderate conservative (even described as such by the New York Times), raised taxes, founded the EPA, and expanded the welfare state. His opponent in the primaries ran against him with the motto “No Left Turn”–but we don’t go around telling people he “wasn’t a real conservative.”

    It’s good to know that he listens to other people, but what I’ve still got to know is why does he continually attend this Trinity church to listen to anti-Jewish, racist ranting?

    But that still doesn’t explain why Obama looks upon a despicable man–a racist, an anti-semite, a race-pimp, and an absolute crackpot–and says “this guy is my spiritual mentor.”
    I haven’t seen any evidence that Obama’s pastor is any of these things.

    http://www.sweetness-light.com.....e-of-color
    http://www.sweetness-light.com.....frocentric
    http://www.mindfully.org/Refor.....3feb03.htm
    Here’s a good start.

    Apparently, the Aryan Nations have their own church. If you saw me coming out of their church, or a “Christian Identity” church (which holds that white people, not the Jews, were God’s chosen people, and [if I remember right] that the Jews stole this birthright and the white folks got to take it back), then how seriously would you take me if I told you not to worry about it, that I’m not racist at all, that I don’t have any problems with the Jews, that “some of my best friends are black”?

    Meanwhile, Bush came to an important decision under Graham’s guidance. Surely, you can see the difference between a single decision and several years of guidance, no?

    For that matter, when has B. Houssein Obama made any statements at all decrying Wright’s crackpot claims?

  37. take_no_prisoners
    March 12th, 2007 at 12:19 am

    Nixon was a liberal when it came to government programs, government spending, government power and government control. He was not a liberal in the libertarian sense of the word–limited government power, spending and control. If he had not had the Watergate fiasco to deal with, he was planning to propose a government run compulsive national health care system, and he probably would have had no problem passing it.

  38. jb1125
    March 12th, 2007 at 8:13 am

    I’m white, Jewish and still don’t believe that Jerimiah Wright is anti-white or anti-Semitic. I believe that he passionately opposes many of the actions of Israel, but that is different from being anti-Semitic . If you can prove that Obama interprets his pastor’s actions and statements as anti-semtic or as anti-white, then I think there would be reasonable grounds to question Obama on why Jerimiah is his spritual mentor. But I haven’t seen anything indicating that. And that being said, he is a spritual mentor, not his poltical policy mentor. He tells Obama to remember to love thy neighbor… not to remember to support divestment from Israel. (Yes, some of his sermons contain politcal themes, but Obama has never indicated that he is influenced anyway other than spritually from the church.)

    “If I say to anybody in Iowa — white, black, Hispanic or Asian — that my church believes in the African-American community strengthening families or adhering to the black work ethic or being committed to self-discipline and self-respect and not forgetting where you came from, I don’t think that’s something anybody would object to. … I think I’d get a few amens.”Obama

    Now, Obama’s views clearly differ from those of his pastor. I don’t think it’s necessary for Obama to publically acknowledge that his views differ. It’s reasonable to assume his views are in fact his views.

    Interview of the Pastor
    http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religi.....rview.html

    ” Someone just asked me … about mentoring Barack and I said, you know, Barrack came here like he is now. ”

    “His position across the years has been I know who I am, I know what I believe, but I don’t disrespect you or diminish you because you have a different belief, and we don’t have to believe the same thing to get along and to build a better world — that we can coexist. That he happens to believe that Shiites and Sunnis and Orthodox Jews and Conservative Jews and Catholics and Protestants can all live in the same neighborhood and have their kids go to school together without fighting and killing each other. That doesn’t we stop praying at home or stop going to church or teach our kids our faith. ”

    Obama’s work with a rabbi:
    http://www.tikkun.org/rabbi_le.....3949597607

    Obama’s support of jews:
    http://www.jewishjournal.com/h.....p?id=17348

    In many respects, I think Nixon was a good president. His policy of detente worked well. And he really opened up American relations with China. But that is its own topic…

  39. SG
    March 22nd, 2007 at 6:18 pm

    An update from the AP:

    Activist Obama Church Enters Spotlight

    By MICHAEL TARM

    March 19, 2007

    A then 26-year-old Barack Obama walked down the aisle of Chicago’s Trinity United Church of Christ, knelt beneath a cross suspended from its rafters and, as he later explained it, committed himself to God after years as a religious skeptic.

    In those early days at the self-described ‘unashamedly black’ church, the future Democratic presidential candidate was moved to tears by a sermon from its activist pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright Jr., whom he has portrayed as his spiritual mentor.

    Two decades later, Obama himself would be Wright’s topic of the day _ but not for reasons either man would have hoped.

    At a recent Sunday service, following media coverage of Obama’s last-minute decision not to have Wright speak at the senator’s presidential announcement last month, Wright warned his flock not to believe any reports of a rift between him and the church’s best-known member.

    ‘Barack and I are fine,’ Wright, 65, on an out-of-state trip, said in a recorded message played to about 2,000 attendees. ‘The press is not to be trusted. … Don’t let somebody outside our camp divide us.’

    The erudite if blunt-speaking pastor also said Obama had apologized for withdrawing the invitation to speak at the Feb. 10 announcement in Springfield.

    Obama had taken ’some bad advice from some of his own campaign people who thought it would not be a good idea for me to be in front of the cameras on the day he announced,’ Wright said, adding that he and Obama had ‘moved on.’ Wright attended the announcement, but he did not speak.

    His impassioned comments came after some conservatives questioned Obama’s links to Trinity, which embraces what it calls a ‘Black Value System.’ Others criticized Obama for appearing to distance himself from the church and its leader.

    Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton said that’s not the case.

    ‘The senator appreciates the continued prayers of his pastor,’ Burton said, adding in a statement that the invitation to Wright was withdrawn because Obama wanted to ‘avoid having statements and beliefs being used out of context and forcing the entire church to defend itself.’

    Wright declined to comment.

    But in an interview with PBS’s ‘Religion & Ethics Newsweekly’ recorded just before Obama’s February announcement, Wright said he warned the senator that their association could pose political problems, partly because of his history of supporting Palestinian causes.

    Wright also told The New York Times in an interview published March 6: ‘When his (Obama’s) enemies find out that in 1984 I went to Tripoli’ with Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan to visit Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi, ‘a lot of his Jewish support will dry up quicker than a snowball in hell.’

    The roughly 8,000-member church has often championed liberal causes, from gay rights to opposition to the Iraq war. It also emphasizes its African roots and asks parishioners to accept the ‘Black Value System,’ which includes tenets such as ‘commitment to the black family,’ ‘dedication to the pursuit of education’ and one critics have seized upon _ ‘disavowal of the pursuit of ‘middleclassness.”

    Obama seemed to preach some of the church’s teachings earlier this month at a commemoration of the 1965 civil rights march in Selma, Ala. He said his generation of blacks needs to strive for something beyond getting ’some of that Oprah money’ and that ‘materialism alone will not fulfill the possibilities of your existence.’

    At Trinity’s lively, music-oriented services, some members wear African-style dress. A red, black and green flag of the pan-African movement stands by the pulpit. On a nearby plaque, Trinity’s motto reads, ‘Unashamedly Black and Unapologetically Christian.’

    For nearly two decades, Obama has identified strongly with Trinity and hasn’t been shy about discussing his closeness to its pastor.

    Wright’s use of ‘audacity of hope’ in one sermon inspired Obama to borrow those words as the title of his best-selling book, ‘The Audacity of Hope.’

    In an earlier memoir, ‘Dreams From My Father,’ Obama also tells how he was moved to tears during that sermon by Wright, an early proponent of the black liberation and black theology movements that gained ground in the 1960s.

    Obama describes what he calls ‘a forceful wind carrying the reverend’s voice up into the rafters’ and how he ‘felt for the first time how that spirit carried within it, nascent, incomplete, the possibility of moving beyond our narrow dreams.’

    The son of a white mother from Kansas, who was skeptical of organized religion, and a Kenyan father, Obama was raised in a secular household. He spent part of his childhood in Indonesia, where he attended a Catholic school and a public school where he took Islamic religion classes.

    He explained how his spiritual journey culminated that day he walked toward the altar at Trinity in a 2006 article on the United Church of Christ’s Web site, writing that as he knelt beneath that cross, ‘I submitted myself to (God’s) will and dedicated myself to discovering His truth.’

    He added that he was drawn to activist churches like Trinity because, in them, ‘I was able to see faith as more than just a comfort to the weary or a hedge against death, but rather as an active, palpable agent in the world.’

    Trinity’s critics, though, say it emphasizes black causes to a fault.

    Fran Eaton, who writes for the conservative blog Illinois Review, singled out Trinity’s 12-point value system, which includes a commitment to ‘pledge allegiance to all black leadership who espouse and embrace the Black Value System.’

    ‘I would feel uncomfortable with a church that used the word ‘white’ instead of ‘black’ when it talked about these things,’ she said. ‘It seems to me we are going backward if we’re basing our churches and the help they give on skin color.’

    Melissa Harris-Lacewell, a politics and African studies professor at Princeton University and an Obama supporter who attended Trinity when she lived in Chicago, dismisses such criticism, saying it only shows ‘most white Americans, most of the time, can be utterly ignorant of how black people worship on Sunday.’

    She added that pinning Wright’s left-leaning politics on Obama isn’t fair.

    ‘The question is what Barack Obama believes, not what Reverend Wright believes,’ she said, ‘because Barack Obama and Reverend Wright may be in agreement on some issues and deeply in disagreement on others.’

    http://www.topix.net/content/a.....2843120671

  40. rocketman
    March 22nd, 2007 at 7:25 pm

    Your turn Dr. OB/GYN

  41. TheTruthHammer
    March 14th, 2008 at 12:12 am

    A Message From our PASTOR, Rev. Dr. Jeremiah A. Wright, Jr., Senior Pastor

    In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the Western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just “disappeared” as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring Black concerns.

    Falwell said, “The ACLU has got to take a lot of blame for this. And I know I’ll hear from them for this, but throwing God…successfully with the help of the federal court system…throwing God out of the public square, out of the schools, the abortionists have got to bear some burden for this because God will not be mocked and when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad…I really believe that the pagans and the abortionists and the feminists and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People for the American Way, all of them who try to secularize America…I point the thing in their face and say you helped this happen.”
    Robertson said, “I totally concur, and the problem is we’ve adopted that agenda at the highest levels of our government, and so we’re responsible as a free society for what the top people do, and the top people, of course, is the court system.”
    Falwell added, “Pat, did you notice yesterday that the ACLU and all the Christ-haters, the People for the American Way, NOW, etc., were totally disregarded by the Democrats and the Republicans in both houses of Congress, as they went out on the steps and and called out to God in prayer and sang ‘God bless America’ and said, let the ACLU be hanged. In other words, when the nation is on its knees, the only normal and natural and spiritual thing to do is what we ought to be doing all the time, calling on God.”


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